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Don't Pay ADM / Markup!

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  • Don't Pay ADM / Markup!

    As public service announcement and hopefully a help to the greater automotive community as a whole: If/When you purchase your C8 DO NOT pay Additional Dealer Markup (cost over MSRP).

    While I'm probably young compared to the average demographic to the vehicles I'm purchased new, I have never paid a markup. You should either! The two that come to mind are the 2014 GT-R and the 2016 GT350. With both I dealt with Stealerships that attempted to charge $5,000 - $20,000 over MSRP for the vehicles. I politely declined and continued my search elsewhere, and was able to find dealers willing to sell the GT350 at MSRP, and the GT-R below MSPR (new 2015 refresh was coming in, I got a decent deal).

    I am not saying anything crazy such as refuse to pay MSRP, you should only offer invoice, etc. MSRP is perfectly fine for all parties involved. It allows Chevy and the dealer to make a profit. What bothers me most about the markups if people pay, is it hurts everyone else attempting to buy the vehicle. I promise you that Chevy will want you to purchase a C8. I promise you that they will make enough that you will be able to purchase one at MSRP! While the US still has to deal with the archaic dealership system, it is wholly unfair for a dealer to demand a markup. They do not do any R&D, testing, development, or building of the vehicle. They are the middle man that by law we have purchase the vehicle through. Also, it gives the dealer a bad reputation. I would be happy to give continued service to a dealer that sells at MSRP and it decent to work with.

    For example of putting my money where my mouth is, I flew to Alabama to purchase the GT350 because all the dealer in my area (VA) wanted $10k over MSRP. The flight and gas home was much less that the $10k cost. I was also in and out of the dealer in 30 minutes from arriving, because they knew I wanted to get on the road. They even picked me up from the airport! That's service right. I'd be more than happy to travel (if needed) for a fair deal on a C8 Z06 And, I would tell anyone thinking about purchasing one to go to that dealer. Whereas the dealer with the markup, I'd tell everyone to avoid.

    All that being said, it's simple. If you refuse to pay ADM, the dealer will not be able to sell a C8 at a markup, and they will stop with the silly games and sell at MSRP. Buying at a markup only hurts your wallet, and the generally community as a whole.

    Soapbox rant over.

  • #2
    Watch out for large documentation fees that appear for the first time on the payment invoice. Paper work is part of the dealer's cost of doing business. When they tack on advertising fees, documentation fees, or other such fees, and do it late in the game, its a foul. Next, they will want to tack on a pro rata share of their municipal property taxes.

    I bought my C7 in Nashua NH. No documentation fees, or anything else that was not part of the initial price. I bought under a "friends and family" GM promotion program, and the price developed on the GM web site for my specific options is exactly what I paid, to the penny, with nothing tacked on by the dealer (MacMulkin).

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    • #3
      Originally posted by P-Tree View Post
      As public service announcement and hopefully a help to the greater automotive community as a whole: If/When you purchase your C8 DO NOT pay Additional Dealer Markup (cost over MSRP).

      While I'm probably young compared to the average demographic to the vehicles I'm purchased new, I have never paid a markup. You should either! The two that come to mind are the 2014 GT-R and the 2016 GT350. With both I dealt with Stealerships that attempted to charge $5,000 - $20,000 over MSRP for the vehicles. I politely declined and continued my search elsewhere, and was able to find dealers willing to sell the GT350 at MSRP, and the GT-R below MSPR (new 2015 refresh was coming in, I got a decent deal).

      I am not saying anything crazy such as refuse to pay MSRP, you should only offer invoice, etc. MSRP is perfectly fine for all parties involved. It allows Chevy and the dealer to make a profit. What bothers me most about the markups if people pay, is it hurts everyone else attempting to buy the vehicle. I promise you that Chevy will want you to purchase a C8. I promise you that they will make enough that you will be able to purchase one at MSRP! While the US still has to deal with the archaic dealership system, it is wholly unfair for a dealer to demand a markup. They do not do any R&D, testing, development, or building of the vehicle. They are the middle man that by law we have purchase the vehicle through. Also, it gives the dealer a bad reputation. I would be happy to give continued service to a dealer that sells at MSRP and it decent to work with.

      For example of putting my money where my mouth is, I flew to Alabama to purchase the GT350 because all the dealer in my area (VA) wanted $10k over MSRP. The flight and gas home was much less that the $10k cost. I was also in and out of the dealer in 30 minutes from arriving, because they knew I wanted to get on the road. They even picked me up from the airport! That's service right. I'd be more than happy to travel (if needed) for a fair deal on a C8 Z06 And, I would tell anyone thinking about purchasing one to go to that dealer. Whereas the dealer with the markup, I'd tell everyone to avoid.

      All that being said, it's simple. If you refuse to pay ADM, the dealer will not be able to sell a C8 at a markup, and they will stop with the silly games and sell at MSRP. Buying at a markup only hurts your wallet, and the generally community as a whole.

      Soapbox rant over.
      Nice rant P-Tree. MSRP will probably be the norm for the first year or two of the C8. I can wait. I have never and will never pay more than or even MSRP. I guess that's just my Economics degree kicking in.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Milliwatt Rob View Post
        Watch out for large documentation fees that appear for the first time on the payment invoice. Paper work is part of the dealer's cost of doing business. When they tack on advertising fees, documentation fees, or other such fees, and do it late in the game, its a foul. Next, they will want to tack on a pro rata share of their municipal property taxes.

        I bought my C7 in Nashua NH. No documentation fees, or anything else that was not part of the initial price. I bought under a "friends and family" GM promotion program, and the price developed on the GM web site for my specific options is exactly what I paid, to the penny, with nothing tacked on by the dealer (MacMulkin).
        Rob, that is exactly the reason why when I negotiate a deal with the dealership, we always settle on a hard number to include all the incidentals. If I say $50k, the $50k check is all I'm gonna write so they better be comfortable with that number to be inclusive of all taxes and fees or I walk.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Fireeagle View Post
          Nice rant P-Tree. MSRP will probably be the norm for the first year or two of the C8. I can wait. I have never and will never pay more than or even MSRP. I guess that's just my Economics degree kicking in.
          Currently in my EMBA. Makes you wonder what the opportunity cost of the mark up is. Many people walking away and telling other not to purchase at that location. Going out on a limb and thinking they're probably losing more than the mark up is worth.

          Originally posted by Milliwatt Rob View Post
          Watch out for large documentation fees that appear for the first time on the payment invoice. Paper work is part of the dealer's cost of doing business. When they tack on advertising fees, documentation fees, or other such fees, and do it late in the game, its a foul. Next, they will want to tack on a pro rata share of their municipal property taxes.

          I bought my C7 in Nashua NH. No documentation fees, or anything else that was not part of the initial price. I bought under a "friends and family" GM promotion program, and the price developed on the GM web site for my specific options is exactly what I paid, to the penny, with nothing tacked on by the dealer (MacMulkin).
          Agreed. I work with Out the Door (OTD) price. Tax/Tag/Tile. It baffles me why some make it so difficult to purchase a vehicle.

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          • #6
            As long as both parties are honest and work in good faith, I have no problem with anyone choosing to pay anything. An acquaintance of mine, super late to the party, chose to pay $25K OVER sticker for his 2015 Z06 — so he could be the first in his area. He got his Z06 super, super early in southern Florida and was a very happy camper. He could well afford it and truly enjoyed every mile of driving it.

            Like each of us paying a different price on a single plane trip (a study found that prices for the identical seat varied to sometimes by a 300% factor), whatever anyone choose to pay for their C8 is just fine with me.

            However, I choose to never pay over sticker. Nice that the three largest Corvette dealers in the country (who are MECF vendors), have put into writing that they are going to not charge over sticker for the C8 — and not once did so for any C6 nor any C7, even for the very limited production models.

            As to paying a documentation fee, different states have different fees and someone needs to pay the dealerships finance and admin staff to deal with their DMV’s, pay a share of local advertising fees, etc. Again, each of us gets to choose what we are willing to pay for that fee and all others.
            Excited owners of a 2015 Z06. Lifetime, annual contributors, and 20 year members of NCM. Our 2020 ME C8 Corvette is next.

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            • #7
              I'll politely disagree with you John. While it's a free market economy, and no one forced your friend to purchase a want (lets face it, all of our sports cars are wants not needs) at a high premium, it gives leverage for the dealership to do these actions to someone else. Especially in places where there are not a variety of dealerships in close(ish) proximity. Sometimes these ADMs give the manufacturer bad press too, when they actually can't 100% affect dealership pricing. As for the doc fees, I'm even willing to go up to $500 for those. I'm still amazed when I say I'll pay MSRP+Tax+Title+$500 doc fee and dealers still act like I'm trying to purchase the vehicle out the door at invoice...

              Perhaps someone saved and budgeted for $80k. Large price delta between that and $105k. Same goes for $60 - $80k.

              That is awesome to hear that forum sponsors have stated they will sell at MSRP! Even the Zed models. I'll be eyeballin' that FPC Z06 in drop top form myself. I'll have to contact them down the road.

              Comment


              • #8
                Thanks and yes, we get to politely disagree. I am a firm believer that each seller gets to set their price for their product and each buyer gets to choose where they buy from. I rarely choose to price shop, instead respecting that each business makes their choices, but in turn I choose when and where I wish to buy from.

                I might care less about paying 20% more than a low bid when I have someone do a house repair if I have 100% confidence in that contractor, but resent someone charging me even a little more on an item that is widely available, i.e., if two top tier gas stations are across the street from one another, say a Shell and a Chevron, I will go across the street to pay 5 cents less per gallon.

                No, I am not logical, but then as an individual consumer, like all, we each get to choose.

                My acquaintance choose to pay $25K more than MSRP to get his Z06 that very day, and if that worked for him, and his smiles told it all, fine with me. However, I have never and would never pay over sticker (exception if one includes the documentation free). However, it a dealer wanted $750 for a doc fee, count me out.

                Same is true of my PDI on my C8, in that I am choosing to pay $100 more at my special Chevy dealer who has the work’s best Corvette Master Tech, than I would be paying at another dealership located about the same distance from my house. But for my Corvette, I am just fine with paying $350 instead of $250 for the PDI because of my confidence in my Corvette Tech Ken.

                Excited owners of a 2015 Z06. Lifetime, annual contributors, and 20 year members of NCM. Our 2020 ME C8 Corvette is next.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I'm all for quality John! Agreed if you know someone will do good work the first time, it can be good to pay for it. Better than getting a half baked product / service, and having to pay more just to fix it or bring it to standards.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I won't pay ADM on anything, but that's a personal choice. I am sometimes amused at the outrage over dealers charging what the market is willing to pay, though. If a car model is selling slowly, everyone expects the dealer to discount the car well below MSRP. Maybe even below invoice, just to clear the lot. Well, the reverse is also true. If a dealer has one and only one Model X, and 10 people who want to buy it, and are willing to bid up the price, why should the dealer forgo the profit (that helps offset losses on other slow selling cars).

                    I don't know where in Virginia P-Tree lives, but in Northern VA where I live you see home buyers bidding up the prices well over asking. A house in my neighborhood recently went on the market, and within 24 hours had 3 offers for $17K over the listing price. Should the seller say "No, no, I really only want [the asking price]? I don't think anyone here would turn down the extra money. Why is a businessman any different?

                    If you want the car, but don't want to pay ADM, you can make an offer at list, and the dealer can decide whether he'd rather wait for a buyer who will pay more or take the money now. But just as it's the buyer's choice what he's willing to pay, it's the dealers choice of what he's willing to accept.

                    (I do think there's an exception for price gouging during emergencies. It's morally wrong, and in many places illegal, to jack up the price of plywood, bottled water, etc. when a hurricane is coming, or after any natural disaster, where the buyers don't have the option to walk away.)

                    The law of supply and demand still holds, most of the time.
                    SunKissed, my 2015 2LT, 7MT, Black over Daytona Sunrise Orange Metallic, Stingray convertible (One of about 40)

                    Purchased 5/2/2015,
                    >31,000+ miles

                    Proud member of the Old Dominion Corvette Club. Check us out http://www.olddominioncorvetteclub.org

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                    • #11
                      I have no problem with supply and demand pricing, so long as there is transparency. All costs and charges should be itemized and totaled up in an "out the door" price before the customer signs or commits to anything.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I couldn't agree more with you more meyerweb !
                        (I do think there's an exception for price gouging during emergencies. It's morally wrong, and in many places illegal, to jack up the price of plywood, bottled water, etc. when a hurricane is coming, or after any natural disaster, where the buyers don't have the option to walk away.)
                        A thought if I might ...

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