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No Blackwing Motor Into A C8

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  • No Blackwing Motor Into A C8

    “Over my dead body” is what Cadillac’s new President said when asked whether Cadillac will share its Blackwing Motor with the Corvette. That is as emphatic as it gets.

    But to me his emphatic denial, means close to nothing — as we will discuss in the next and following thread posts. First however, it is interesting to read this Automobile Magazine article about this and related Cadillac questions.

    Click image for larger version  Name:	F9385850-41AA-4E6B-9641-F0E84A8CC31D.jpeg Views:	0 Size:	426.2 KB ID:	29663

    Originally posted by Automobilie
    Mine, All Mine: Cadillac Isn’t Sharing Its Twin-Turbo Blackwing V-8

    The powerful engine will remain exclusive. For now.

    By: Alisa Priddle March 15, 2019

    The answer to whether Cadillac will share its Blackwing engine with other brands is about as emphatic as it gets: “Over my dead body,” Cadillac President Steve Carlisle tells us.

    “Blackwing” is the name given to the 4.2-liter twin-turbo V-8 stuffed in the Cadillac CT6-V as well as the top-trim CT6 Platinum. The V version pumps out 550 horsepower and 627 lb-ft of torque, while output in the lesser CT6 is expected to be 500 horsepower and 553 lb-ft. It pairs with a 10-speed automatic transmission in both cars.

    The CT6-V is a limited-build model—just 275 units were initially planned, and those were sold out within hours of the car being announced this past January. We have now learned Cadillac has decided to build additional examples, but Carlisle says the final number hasn’t yet been decided. He also didn’t say when they might become available to prospective buyers.

    The Blackwing engine is made in Bowling Green, Kentucky, and is also expected to power the top-spec versions of the next-generation Escalade slated to arrive next year as a 2021 model. There has been speculation the Blackwing could end up in a Corvette, but that seems to not be the case—at least for now. The CT6 had been expected to be discontinued, as GM is closing its Detroit-Hamtramck assembly plant, but GM extended CT6 production through January 2020, and we understand that it could be extended further still. The automaker is looking at alternatives for assembly, with one possibility involving altering the platform slightly so the car could be slotted into the Lansing, Michigan, plant that currently builds the XT5 and the XT6.

    The CT6 is also assembled in China for that market, but Carlisle says that he would prefer not to make China the sole global source and to deal with the tariffs and logistics that would accompany such a decision. Meanwhile, the refreshed CT6 will arrive in showrooms soon.
    https://www.automobilemag.com/news/c...win-turbo-v-8/

    Last edited by John; 03-17-2019, 06:56 PM.
    GBA Black; HTO Twilight/Tension interior; Z51 & Mag Ride; E60 lift; 5VM visible carbon fiber package; 5ZZ high wing; FA5 interior vis CF; ZZ3 engine appearance; 3LT; Q8T Spectra Gray Tridents; J6N Edge Red Calipers; SNG Edge Red Hashmarks; VQK Splash Guards; RCC Edge Red engine cover; VJR illuminated sill plates. Lifetime, annual contributors, and 23 year members of National Corvette Museum. Home is the beautiful Pacific Northwest.

  • #2
    GM learned from the ignition switch debacle to never use a part which is even 99% the same as another one, yet give it the same part number. So clearly looking at the above, the Corvette is not going to have its engine cover saying, "Cadillac. Nor would 20 other parts on the Blackwing be identical to what motor will highly probably be going into the HP version of the C8.

    Mr. Carlisle, you are absolute 100% correct that the Blackwing motor is not going into a C8.

    And yet, might a motor that is functionally extremely close to the Blackwing, go into a Corvette? We all know the anwser to that, and remember the IHS Market study specifically listed as a C8 motor, a 4.2L, 32V, TT, DOHC, V8 (does that sound similar to the Blackwing).

    GM spend hundreds of millions of dollars creating the Blackwing. It is only going in a few hundred CT-6’s? Even afterwards if it were to going into the 2021 Cadillac Escala, that usage also would be for a model without significant projected annual sales.

    We doubt that, instead believee that GM will instead amortize its massive Blackwing costs into another product, and with some "exterior changes," what would make more sense than it going into a C8 Z06 -- albeit with a different name and a different part number?

    Or could it go both into a C8 Z06 and into the Cadillac Escalade — with a different, maybe third name and a third part number?
    Last edited by John; 03-17-2019, 07:27 PM.
    GBA Black; HTO Twilight/Tension interior; Z51 & Mag Ride; E60 lift; 5VM visible carbon fiber package; 5ZZ high wing; FA5 interior vis CF; ZZ3 engine appearance; 3LT; Q8T Spectra Gray Tridents; J6N Edge Red Calipers; SNG Edge Red Hashmarks; VQK Splash Guards; RCC Edge Red engine cover; VJR illuminated sill plates. Lifetime, annual contributors, and 23 year members of National Corvette Museum. Home is the beautiful Pacific Northwest.

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    • #3
      The same basic block, crank, pistons, turbos outside the vee instead of a hot-vee design, new heads, intake and exhaust to match the reversed flow. and viola, the "Not a Blackwing" is ready for the C8. Call it the LT6.
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      • #4
        You got that right meyerweb.

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        • #5
          Maybe a MantaWing or a Z-Wing?

          Comment


          • #6
            "Over my dead body" is code; it means: For Pete's sake stop asking questions that you know I am prohibited to discuss. Over my dead body will you get a response.

            It is a very direct and truthful answer to the real question. "Will you casually violate the GM confidentiality rules to satisfy my curiosity". Answer: "Over my dead body".
            Last edited by SheepDog; 03-18-2019, 11:27 AM.

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            • #7
              Given how frequently Cadillac changes Presidents over the last decade, expect that engine to be a C8 option in 2021 at the latest.

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              • #8
                According to Carscoops the C8 will be available with three V8 engines which are a naturally-aspirated 6.2, a 5.5 and a 5.5 twin turbo engine.

                Link: https://www.carscoops.com/2019/03/mi...detroit-tests/

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by WoW Factor View Post
                  According to Carscoops the C8 will be available with three V8 engines which are a naturally-aspirated 6.2, a 5.5 and a 5.5 twin turbo engine.

                  Link: https://www.carscoops.com/2019/03/mi...detroit-tests/
                  "a naturally-aspirated 6.2, a 5.5 and a 5.5 twin turbo engine"

                  If this is a valid scoop, then the C8 will be interesting. The engine in the middle. And not even talking controversial flat-plane. That talk stimulates too much steam.
                  Last edited by SheepDog; 03-18-2019, 07:32 PM.

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                  • #10
                    If we get as we strongly suspect, a 500 HP, LT2 @ 6.2L, what do we suppose would be the power output of the 5.5 NA and what do we think a 5.5 TT might produce?

                    And if those numbers you are imagining do not get you giddy, imagine adding to the 5.5L, TT, two electrical motors rated about 130 HP (combined) would create?

                    ​​​​Exciting Powertrain options ahead....

                    Though as SheepDog noted, the key word here is “IF.”
                    GBA Black; HTO Twilight/Tension interior; Z51 & Mag Ride; E60 lift; 5VM visible carbon fiber package; 5ZZ high wing; FA5 interior vis CF; ZZ3 engine appearance; 3LT; Q8T Spectra Gray Tridents; J6N Edge Red Calipers; SNG Edge Red Hashmarks; VQK Splash Guards; RCC Edge Red engine cover; VJR illuminated sill plates. Lifetime, annual contributors, and 23 year members of National Corvette Museum. Home is the beautiful Pacific Northwest.

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                    • #11
                      I think the dohc twin turbo will a shorter stroke down to 3.9 liters...especially if there is a flat plan crank but even if not a flat plane crank..i still think 4 liters will be no more than 4 liters,...but its just a guess.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by SheepDog View Post

                        "a naturally-aspirated 6.2, a 5.5 and a 5.5 twin turbo engine"

                        If this is a valid scoop, then the C8 will be interesting. The engine in the middle. And not even talking controversial flat-plane. That talk stimulates too much steam.
                        This would fit perfectly with my hope/guess of a baseline stingray, the GS becomes the 5.5 NA track car and the Z06 continues as the high hp GT sports car!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by SheepDog View Post
                          "Over my dead body" is code; it means: For Pete's sake stop asking questions that you know I am prohibited to discuss. Over my dead body will you get a response.

                          It is a very direct and truthful answer to the real question. "Will you casually violate the GM confidentiality rules to satisfy my curiosity". Answer: "Over my dead body".
                          Didn't they fire that guy? I thought they got a new Cadillac boss. So who made that statement?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            The new Cadillac President Steve Carlisle made this week’s statement. Though a very similar content statement was made last October by then Cadillac President de Nysschen.
                            GBA Black; HTO Twilight/Tension interior; Z51 & Mag Ride; E60 lift; 5VM visible carbon fiber package; 5ZZ high wing; FA5 interior vis CF; ZZ3 engine appearance; 3LT; Q8T Spectra Gray Tridents; J6N Edge Red Calipers; SNG Edge Red Hashmarks; VQK Splash Guards; RCC Edge Red engine cover; VJR illuminated sill plates. Lifetime, annual contributors, and 23 year members of National Corvette Museum. Home is the beautiful Pacific Northwest.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by TtiME View Post

                              This would fit perfectly with my hope/guess of a baseline stingray, the GS becomes the 5.5 NA track car and the Z06 continues as the high hp GT sports car!


                              If the C8 Vette gets a version of the Blackwing Engine then that "DOHC C8" will probably cost at least as much as the Cadillac ----- Over $92K to /96K$. The well Optioned C8 DOHC Blackwing will cost ?????????

                              Then the naturally aspirated DOHC 5,5 liter will be the sweet spot under the TT.? Is that your Grand Sport?

                              Speculation:
                              6.2 liter pushrod ---- Start at 70K$ ??????????
                              5.5 liter naturally aspirated ------ Start at 95K$ ??????????
                              5.5 liter TT ------ Start at 115K$ ------- ??????????
                              Speculation


                              Read below:


                              GM Authority2019 Cadillac CT6-V Gets $4,000 Price Hike For Second Run

                              54Sponsored Links



                              In January, Cadillac opened the U.S. pre-order books for the 2019 CT6-V. The car sold out within minutes, meaning the 275 allocated examples for the U.S. had buyers. However, just over a month later, Cadillac announced the original 275 were pre-order allocations for customers who wanted to be first. A second installment is coming, though Cadillac won’t say how many it’ll be built. However, those who failed to get one of the first 275 examples will be disappointed to learn the CT6-V’s price is increasing by $4,000, according to CarsDirect.com.

                              When Cadillac opened the pre-order books, the CT6-V had a starting price of $88,790 including destination. Cadillac has since raised the sticker price to $92,790 without increasing the amount of standard equipment that comes with the car comes. However, customers still get the all-new, hand-built 4.2-liter twin-turbo V8 LTA engine called Blackwingrated at 550 horsepower and 627 pound-feet of torque, which pairs with the GM 10-speed automatic transmission sending power to the wheels via an all-wheel-drive system.



                              The price increase will likely further upset customers once they learn a detuned version of the engine making 500 hp will be available in the range-topping CT6 Platinum trim with a starting price of $96,790. That’s a lot of cash for an American luxury performance sedan at a time when sedans aren’t in vogue. Then there’s the CTS-V that starts at $87,990 that could entice buyers looking to save a few dollars.

                              There’s been a lot of speculation surrounding the future of the Cadillac CT6 after General Motors announced it planned to idle the Detroit-Hamtramck Assembly where GM builds the sedan. After GM’s announcement, with the death of the CT6 supposedly cemented in the history books, the automaker announced it was working on counting the model by moving production elsewhere months after confirming the car would still be available in China. Now there are rumors GM is developing a second-generation Cadillac CT6 that’ll ride on GM’s modular, rear-wheel-drive VSS-R platform. Maybe we’ll get a second-generation CT6-V and an improved Blackwing engine, too.

                              Read more: http://gmauthority.com/blog/2019/03/...#ixzz5if7zeoho
                              Last edited by SheepDog; 03-19-2019, 06:40 PM.

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